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Forum: General

Topic: Getting deep

This topic contains 15 replies, has 2,564 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of ClevelandPumpkins ClevelandPumpkins 9 years, 11 months ago.

On ClevelandPumpkins wrote:

To me, the main driving force behind Pumpkins music is EMOTION. Be it the highest high, or the lowest low. (not to mention getting you from the valley to the peak) I have always wondered if the music affects other ppl as deeply as it has me(?) At my end, many a decision has been made by chillin’ out, throwing in some Pumpkins, and thinkin’ it out. ?

Ribbit...Toad-----------------Toads are really underated!!
Profile photo of bleedingtheorchid
Member
On BleedingTheOrchid wrote:

toad32r, again you seem to say what I wanted to say! and you know what’s so funny: the hardest rockin’ tunes of the pumpkins make me quiet and peaceful. weird huh

Emptiness is loneliness, and loneliness is cleanlinessAnd cleanliness is godliness, and god is empty just like meIntoxicated with the madness, I'm in love with my sadness
Profile photo of Superlordspamulon
Member
On Superlordspamulon wrote:

hmm… yeah i feel all sots of emotions too… in recent times, my girlfriend broke up with me – i listen to mayonaise and feel connected to it, and feel better, feel like i can get past it
i took loads of shit at school one day and, during gym, had enough so went off on my own – found a quiet spot on my own, listened to BWBFW, and got angry at those people, and felt like i was better than them (in a non bad way, if you get my drift) and that they are nothing – and that in the end, no matter what they say, i am still better. this made me feel better, as if i could get past all that too
listening to for martha, i well up with the emotion of it all
today just makes me feel all light and happy, and makes me want to roll around not unlike in the video :lol:
and then a whole plethora of emotions from other songs not least from MCIS :)

So apparently I don't post very often these days
Profile photo of captjack
Member
On CaptJack wrote:

Billy has a very healthy, very powerful range of emotions.
Every has the ability to feel these. but most people don’t, preferring something to take the edge off or numb them, such as drugs, etc.

Anger, Doubt, Fear, Regret, Love, Joy, Sadness, Sympathy, Loneliness, Need & Wonder are all in the songs in bucket fulls, in different songs in different ways.

Some fans have focused on only one or two of these emotions and want all of the songs to be about that instead of accepting the full range.

This is why when fans say they hate Adore or especially Machina they disagree on which songs make the album bad.

SP are the first emo band (in a good way I should hope) and they follow in the footsteps of John Lennon and Bob Dylan and Johnny Cash who discussed dark things, wore their heart on their sleeves, didn’t just write to make hit songs, and also declared optimism despite their experiences that should have drummed that out of them.

Profile photo of Superlordspamulon
Member
On Superlordspamulon wrote:

Billy has a very healthy, very powerful range of emotions.
Every has the ability to feel these. but most people don’t, preferring something to take the edge off or numb them, such as drugs, etc.

Anger, Doubt, Fear, Regret, Love, Joy, Sadness, Sympathy, Loneliness, Need & Wonder are all in the songs in bucket fulls, in different songs in different ways.

Some fans have focused on only one or two of these emotions and want all of the songs to be about that instead of accepting the full range.

This is why when fans say they hate Adore or especially Machina they disagree on which songs make the album bad.

SP are the first emo band (in a good way I should hope) and they follow in the footsteps of John Lennon and Bob Dylan and Johnny Cash who discussed dark things, wore their heart on their sleeves, didn’t just write to make hit songs, and also declared optimism despite their experiences that should have drummed that out of them.[/quote:cz8fzve7]
emo should be in inverted commas :lol:
and the first emo bands were an offshoot of nyc hardcore (namely rites of spring) which began aroung late 80’s, early 90’s… so SP arent really…
sorry i just feel like being pedantic :P

So apparently I don't post very often these days
Profile photo of toad32r
Participant
On toad32r wrote:

Capt…..EXACTLY! Ppl DO focus on the emotions that they choose to. The true range of emotion is NOT something you choose, its what you feel. To not allow sadness in, dulls the happiness that follows. You cant have one without the other. There is happy, there is sad, but more importantly, there are a million points in between. Its not a black and white situation. Ppl need to let in the grey. The ppl that dont let it in, dont fully understand the range of emotion Billy brings to the table.

Ribbit...Toad-----------------Toads are really underated!!
Profile photo of bleedingtheorchid
Member
On BleedingTheOrchid wrote:

… The ppl that dont let it in, dont fully understand the range of emotion Billy brings to the table.[/quote:oppqbdvg]
exactly. so f***ing true this. always when i try to explain to people what bonds me to the music of the pumpkins, i say its their wide range of emotions they sing/scream/whisper/cry about. i recognize them, almost all of them. i wished i was as creative as this guy to make music in his way. i cant so i listen and let billy be my substitute for a career i never could have had. anyway, when i let people listen to some pumpkins tracks, they either keep neutral or just are being negative. when i asked why a few times its because they dont understand it, its weird, it doesnt make sense, the lyrics go nowhere… meanwhile their faces just show how little they are in contact with themselves…

Emptiness is loneliness, and loneliness is cleanlinessAnd cleanliness is godliness, and god is empty just like meIntoxicated with the madness, I'm in love with my sadness
Profile photo of Superlordspamulon
Member
On Superlordspamulon wrote:

i think, CaptJack, you hit the nail on the head with that one – made an observation ALL of us can relate to!
excellent job!

So apparently I don't post very often these days
Profile photo of captjack
Member
On CaptJack wrote:

1) I meant emo in a very loose way and only relating to the current crop of emo bands who relate to the Pumpkins. The only one of those I truly like is My Chemical Romance because they don’t care about the so called emo rules and boundaries.

Emo is as untrue a label as Punk and Alernative were, but that’s for a different thread.

2) Re: people latching on to one emotion I saw people on smashing pumpkins.com (where I get beat to a pulp on the message boards daily, btw) complaining that the second song on Letterman (Friday) will be That’s the Way (My Love is) instead of Doomsday Clock.

A) That’s the Way is the next single
B) BC wants to show another side of his writing after playing Tarantula Monday.

Look at MCIS as an album and the emotions are all over the place, song to song.

Love is cynical and Cupid de Locke is romantic.
An Ode to No one seems an angry lament to God while Muzzle seems a celebration of a blessed life.

And look at the singles. No band since The Beatles has had as much variety in their releases.

Bullet, Zero, 33, Tonight Tonight and 1979.

No other band in the 90’s could have released 2 heavy songs, 1 poppy ballad, 1 lonely ballad and 1 orchestral extravaganza.

Look at The Beatles with Revolution and Hey Jude as double A-sides or the way John would be dark one second (Yer Blues, etc.) and gleeful the next (Dear Prudence, etc.).

They say Kurt Cobain was the Lennon of the 90’s and indeed he lit the fire of rock like only The Beatles and Ramones before him, but it was Billy who was the innovator (The Beatles) and the conscience (Dylan) of the 1990’s. History will prove this once the rest of the music world catches up to him.

Did everyone understand Mozart in his time? Doubt it. And I know for a fact they had no clue what Edgar Allen Poe was achieving. Some people are too far ahead of the curve for the herd mentality.

Profile photo of Superlordspamulon
Member
On Superlordspamulon wrote:

1) I meant emo in a very loose way and only relating to the current crop of emo bands who relate to the Pumpkins. The only one of those I truly like is My Chemical Romance because they don’t care about the so called emo rules and boundaries.

Emo is as untrue a label as Punk and Alernative were, but that’s for a different thread.

2) Re: people latching on to one emotion I saw people on smashing pumpkins.com (where I get beat to a pulp on the message boards daily, btw) complaining that the second song on Letterman (Friday) will be That’s the Way (My Love is) instead of Doomsday Clock.

A) That’s the Way is the next single
B) BC wants to show another side of his writing after playing Tarantula Monday.

Look at MCIS as an album and the emotions are all over the place, song to song.

Love is cynical and Cupid de Locke is romantic.
An Ode to No one seems an angry lament to God while Muzzle seems a celebration of a blessed life.

And look at the singles. No band since The Beatles has had as much variety in their releases.

Bullet, Zero, 33, Tonight Tonight and 1979.

No other band in the 90’s could have released 2 heavy songs, 1 poppy ballad, 1 lonely ballad and 1 orchestral extravaganza.

Look at The Beatles with Revolution and Hey Jude as double A-sides or the way John would be dark one second (Yer Blues, etc.) and gleeful the next (Dear Prudence, etc.).

They say Kurt Cobain was the Lennon of the 90’s and indeed he lit the fire of rock like only The Beatles and Ramones before him, but it was Billy who was the innovator (The Beatles) and the conscience (Dylan) of the 1990’s. History will prove this once the rest of the music world catches up to him.

Did everyone understand Mozart in his time? Doubt it. And I know for a fact they had no clue what Edgar Allen Poe was achieving. Some people are too far ahead of the curve for the herd mentality.[/quote:16z0zw80]
…stop being so goddam insightful! it’s making me look bad :lol:
yeah… im a huge mcr fan. fuck it, im an obsessive – the one band i love more than the pumpkins (judge all the fuck you want – they saved my life :P). oh and gerard way kinda looks like Billy Corgan. there are actually quite a few similarities between the two bands… (fuck, NEVER get me started on mcr, i always side track then :S)
and i love the song cupid de locke – and as such i looked into it a bit more (well, i read between the lines) and am i the only one who thinks it seems a lttile bit menacing? it has a few lines which don’t sound that good… like nice not-that-good, not badly written not-that-good (e.g "your world be shattered with nary a note/ of one cupids arrow under your coat" maybe im not understanding it correctly then…)
i get sidetracked to easily…
but excellent point, i must say!

So apparently I don't post very often these days
Profile photo of captjack
Member
On CaptJack wrote:

You’re right Cupid definitely has that bittersweet undertone, but then so does real love.
Hallmark has us all fooled that it’s all sunshine and roses.

Profile photo of toad32r
Participant
On toad32r wrote:

Let me get a little deeper… 2 years ago i broke my back at work, pretty bad. I was taken in and had a hell of a surgery to fix what was broken. When i woke up, i found out that the surgery went wrong, they took me back in 3 days later, to try and fix what the surgeons did wrong…i am now a incomplete paraplegic, what that means is paralisis from the knee down on my left leg, and 75% use of my lower right leg. 32 years old…no driving, no working, 3 kids, a wife, bills. SP was one of the biggest helps to regain and remind me of who i am inside, not what physical limitations i have. Now 2 years later, i can walk with a brace, and a cane…i was told i wouldn’t be able to. It was because of faith, belief, and staying positive. Pumpkins helped with that more than any damn high paid doctor ever did. That is where my emotional attachment lies. The importance of finding ones faith, be it religion, music, or where ever an individual finds it, is the first step in getting to where you need to be… without it, you can just be left setting in a wheelchair, waiting for nothing to happen.

Ribbit...Toad-----------------Toads are really underated!!
Profile photo of captjack
Member
On CaptJack wrote:

Amen toad32r and well put.

So many people think Billy is always down or negative, and while that is a part of all of us, it is not the only part and BC shows that to a tee.

Peaks and Valleys.

Faith and Doubt.

Love and Lonely.

Life and Death.

Profile photo of Superlordspamulon
Member
On Superlordspamulon wrote:

wow… this topic is really going somewhere, huh?
and toad32r? well done! it’s amazing that one band could help you walk again… something that so many take for granted. it’s amazing how much pumpkins have done for people world over

So apparently I don't post very often these days
Profile photo of toad32r
Participant
On toad32r wrote:

LOL, at the Detroit show on Oct. 7th, look for pictures with a guy holding a cane up in the air. That will be me. Ill be up front, center. Strange way to be seen in pix, i know ! :D

Ribbit...Toad-----------------Toads are really underated!!
Profile photo of ClevelandPumpkins
Member
On ClevelandPumpkins wrote:

Billy has a very healthy, very powerful range of emotions.
Every has the ability to feel these. but most people don’t, preferring something to take the edge off or numb them, such as drugs, etc.

Anger, Doubt, Fear, Regret, Love, Joy, Sadness, Sympathy, Loneliness, Need & Wonder are all in the songs in bucket fulls, in different songs in different ways.

Some fans have focused on only one or two of these emotions and want all of the songs to be about that instead of accepting the full range.

This is why when fans say they hate Adore or especially Machina they disagree on which songs make the album bad.

SP are the first emo band (in a good way I should hope) and they follow in the footsteps of John Lennon and Bob Dylan and Johnny Cash who discussed dark things, wore their heart on their sleeves, didn’t just write to make hit songs, and also declared optimism despite their experiences that should have drummed that out of them.[/quote:39o71dyl]

Hear, hear! You hit the nail on the head!

8)

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